Not yet possible to download??

maybe tomorrow

Wonderful
Tought there would be some other features like "better altitude hold". (i can remember i read that somewhere a few days ago...)

Hi Holger. Even at 99% in the emergency gas value my 6kg machine falls much too fast prior to touchdown. Any possibility of removing the emergency gas/throttle values altogether and shifting to universal descent rates regardless of copter weight? i.e. When the machine is back to the takeoff position it descends from the preset CH altitude at ~2m/sec until an altitude of ~4m at which point it slows to ~0.5m/sec until ground contact.

Yep, that would be much much better

seattle_helo meinte

Hi Holger. Even at 99% in the emergency gas value my 6kg machine falls much too fast prior to touchdown. Any possibility of removing the emergency gas/throttle values altogether and shifting to universal descent rates regardless of copter weight? i.e. When the machine is back to the takeoff position it descends from the preset CH altitude at ~2m/sec until an altitude of ~4m at which point it slows to ~0.5m/sec until ground contact.

That is a great idea. Would be nice if Holger could do an update for this.

I have a question,

Why is neccessary a FailSafe channel?

Receivers with failsafe can be programmed to keep an specific position for each channel in case of signal failure, so you can program the Free-PH-CH channel to switch to CH in case of signal failure. The same with AH.

Maybe some receivers only can program the first 4 channels?

I´m doing this question because I only have 8 channels and need to choose some functions and discard others, if I can save one channel here that would be nice

AndresMtnez meinte

Maybe some receivers only can program the first 4 channels?

I´ve just realized in this case you couldn´t program the failsafe channel so I must be missing something....

There are some different ways to report signal loss. MK support 2 different ones:
- The RX sends a "loss of signal"-signal to the FC.
- The RX internally detects the signal-loss, and goes to a preset failsafe, that set the channels to predefined values.

The failsafe channel is necessary for the preset failsafe.

http://mikrokopter.de/ucwiki/en/FailSafe - read more here

I´ve read that some times

But the question is,

There´s any difference between using CH normally, without signal loss, or using CH as failsafe?

If I can pre-set the failsafe of the rx to change to CH with a signal-loss, does it really matter if the MK doesn´t reconize the signal-loss?

More questions

This is an information box at the end of Navi-Ctrl 2 parameter wiki page, after the CH altitude explanation:

"INFO
The height will be flown (as well as for the height requirements for the waypoints) only in Vario-Height control.
And only if the throttle stick is in neutral position."

Does that mean if you´re flying in Height Limitation Control you can´t use CH?

And if stick must be in neutral position, you still have control of the MK while in CH function?


Sorry for so many questions, but I will hopefully maiden my oktoXL this week and need to be sure I´m doing things correctly

It means what it says

The CH _altitude_ functionality will only be possible in vario ah mode.

The CH altitude will only work if Vario is set, if you have Height Limitation set the MK will stay at your current height and won't go to any preset failsafe height. Thats how I understand it anyway.

AndresMtnez meinte

I have a question,

Why is neccessary a FailSafe channel?

Receivers with failsafe can be programmed to keep an specific position for each channel in case of signal failure, so you can program the Free-PH-CH channel to switch to CH in case of signal failure. The same with AH.

The question is still here....

If I can set the rx failsafe to keep the first 4 channels centered, to switch to CH and to connect AH, why is neccessary a failsafe channel?

Does it really matter that the MK doesn´t reconize the signal loss if it´s "reading" from the rx that you´ve connected CH?

I don´t understand why my question remains unanswered.....

Holger has been very fast on Bart´s topic trying to "elude" responsabilities replying in the same day even when nobody knows the reason of the crash (no log, no video, just a description), but he can´t answer this simple question wich is here for three weeks??





I´m sure this is absurdly basic for him, but the only way I have to solve it is risking my whole oktoXL testing things that could be answered in a few seconds......


I sometimes don´t understand this people

Hi Andres,

did not tried CH-failsafe yet, but I see some differences between a RX-only and CH failsafe.

My RX only allows to set the value of first 4 channels on failsafe, so I could not engage AH and CH.
Moreover, CH-Failsafe allows to sequence (CH first, then land).

I guess could be tricky to handle this on RX-only, but maybe I'm a bit outdate and modern RX have better failsafe than mine

bye,
Federico

@AndresMtnez:
Actually I didn't understand your question, but I will try to answer:

Normally the MikroKopter detects the RC lost when the sum signal gets lost. So the receiver must stop sending the sum signal in that case. Receivers like Jeti, HoTT, Futaba and some other are doing that.
But there are also some brands that will continue sending the sum signal. For that case you can select the Failsafe-Channel.

Anyway, in both cases of failsafe the MK will set Nick, Roll and Yaw to neutral in case of Failsafe.

Hi Holger,

The question is if there´s any difference between CH activated by the failsafe and CH activated by the tx

Since I can set the 8ch of my rx when losing signal to a predefined position I can set it to CH with AH, exactly the same as if I activate CH manually.

So I´m not sure if there´s any difference between this situation (MK does NOT detect the signal lost, but reads I´m activating CH) and CH activated by failsafe (MK does detect the signal lost and activate CH)

Thanks

There are many differences ( sequenced actions / timing ) - please read http://mikrokopter.de/ucwiki/en/FailSafe#The_function or the first post in this thread ..

Hi

I've read that many times, but dont explain any difference....

it sure does:

Zitat

If the MikroKopter detects a loosing signal the FailSafe-Function will be active for maximal 60 Seconds with the following functions (from version V0.88 FlightCtrl):
(This time you can enter under "Failsafe CH time": Link.)
First at all the function "PositionHold" will be activated for 5 seconds and the Kopter climbs/falls to the preset "ComingHome Altitude". (note: only if the distance from the starting point is >25m)
After the 5 seconds the function "ComingHome" will be automatically activated and the Kopter flies back into the direction of the Homeposition (Start Point).
(If the set altitude shouldn't have been reached within the first 5 seconds increases or decreases the Kopter its altitude during the flight back.)
If the signal restores again a normal control is possible.
If the signal is not restoring at that time the Kopter will fly back to the Homeposition and will switch there automatically into a fixed rate of descent and tries to land.
For the way back and the descent to the Homeposition the left over 55 seconds are available.

e,g, your transmitter failsave will do no controlling of altitude

Hi,

RX failsafe could engage the CH and AH potis and set Throttle to 127 (hovering) or something less for a controlled landing (assuming the MK is configured for Vario mode).

The key here is sequencing, since I do not think that he could set the failsafe for keeping the throttle=127 until home reached, and then to come down.

Bye,
Federico

ligi meinte

it sure does:

Zitat

If the MikroKopter detects a loosing signal the FailSafe-Function will be active for maximal 60 Seconds with the following functions (from version V0.88 FlightCtrl):
[...]automatically into a fixed rate of descent and tries to land.
For the way back and the descent to the Homeposition the left over 55 seconds are available.

e,g, your transmitter failsave will do no controlling of altitude

ligi meinte

it sure does:

Zitat

If the MikroKopter detects a loosing signal the FailSafe-Function will be active for maximal 60 Seconds with the following functions (from version V0.88 FlightCtrl):
(This time you can enter under "Failsafe CH time": Link.)
First at all the function "PositionHold" will be activated for 5 seconds and the Kopter climbs/falls to the preset "ComingHome Altitude". (note: only if the distance from the starting point is >25m)
After the 5 seconds the function "ComingHome" will be automatically activated and the Kopter flies back into the direction of the Homeposition (Start Point).
(If the set altitude shouldn't have been reached within the first 5 seconds increases or decreases the Kopter its altitude during the flight back.)
If the signal restores again a normal control is possible.
If the signal is not restoring at that time the Kopter will fly back to the Homeposition and will switch there automatically into a fixed rate of descent and tries to land.
For the way back and the descent to the Homeposition the left over 55 seconds are available.

e,g, your transmitter failsave will do no controlling of altitude

As Federico says it can connect AH too, but I guess what you mean is the CH altitude, wich is NOT effective when connecting CH manually or via the rx failsafe, it only works via the MK failsafe, right?

I didn´t want to get dirty the thread, but then I´ve realiced this is the Failsafe thread, so here are all my doubts about it:


1.- I don´t understand the limitation of the CH altitude, wich only works when the MK is further than 25m
What I love of multicopters is that you can fly in places with lots of trees or very precipitous or craggy terrains, and this could be a problem. I don´t see any sense to this limitation. It only works with gas>40 for more than 4 seconds, that´s enough I think


2.- The CH time doesn´t have any sense to me either. I don´t see any single advantage of a time limitation but see lots of potential problems. I guess if you set it to "0" you´re deactivating the CH feature, don´t you?


3.- Why the final descent in CH is determined automatically but we still have to set the Emergency Gas? If it can be determined automatically I don´t understand the reason to set the emergency gas manually. It´s a PITA if you don´t have wireless connection, and if you change the payload it could be VERY dangerous. Can you imagine the MK climbing (because when you set it it was heavier and for some reason now it´s lighter) until the battery is empty and then falling like a stone from a very high altitude?


4.- Same for Emergency Gas Time, with presure sensor and GPS the MK "knows" when the descent has finished, so it could stop motors automatically in that moment. Now it could stop motors in the air, or it could keep motors spinning after landing in weeds/brushes, wich will ruin your props balance in best case scenario, and throw lots of dirty to the boards, camera/s, motors.... (don´t ask how I know it )


BTW, please don´t think I´m criticizing the Failsafe feature.... well I´m doing it, but from a constructive point of view, I see perfection very close